Celtic and Rangers don’t pull the strings in SPL setup
The tail can wag the dog at times
It is somewhat inevitable that when talk of SPL reconstruction surfaces, the focus falls on Celtic and Rangers. This is slightly ironic given that the voting system means these two on their own are fairly powerless. The SPL is not set up for the benefit of the two big clubs but with all due respect, neither should it be set up purely for the self preservation of other clubs.
The latest statement from Neil Doncaster raises hopes for a 16 team league.
One of the arguments is the fact that four league games versus one team per season is very dull. It does not allow for freshness and when add in cup competitions; teams could face each other up to seven times.
St Mirren and Rangers fans will be spared this outcome only through the likelihood of the Paisley club finishing in the bottom six.
However, there are financial considerations which could keep the four game set up in place.
Much of the money coming in from Sky is down to the fact that they can show the big two clash four times a season. The nature of the game makes it of interest to a wider audience than the SPL would usually obtain. If these clashes were halved, Sky may be looking to pay in less cash, which hurts all teams.
Also, the current set-up guarantees smaller clubs at least three home games versus Celtic and Rangers.
True, the attendances are not as big as they used to be for these games but they are still lucrative. Losing one, maybe two games of this nature is hardly likely to please the chairmen of the SPL.
The same can be said for Celtic and Rangers.
Their fans would have one fewer big home game and would lose out elsewhere too. A home game versus Hibs, Hearts, Dundee United and Aberdeen would all be lost to these clubs, replaced by visits from Dundee, Queen of the South, Partick Thistle and Inverness Caley.
More variety but less quality is no guarantee to get the punters through the door.
On a football scale, changing the number and format is unlikely to alter the familiarity at the top of the table. It will have a massive effect on the middle order of teams though.
A top 16 would leave clubs like Kilmarnock, St Mirren and Motherwell having to re-evaluate their role in the league. Barring disaster, they will be out of the relegation zone long before the climax of the season. Barring a miracle, they will have fallen short of the European slots before the business end of the season kicks in.
There will always be cup ties and the hope of giving a bloody nose to the big two but in reality, what would these clubs hope for?
Nothing much more than turning up and taking the TV money. And would the fans be happy with that outcome?
This is a topic that can be discussed endlessly so we’ll leave it here but no do doubt come back to view it from a couple of different angles.
What is your take on any proposed changes to the SPL?
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Big problems ahead to get things back on track
1.The average person has more interests which effects football attendaces.
2.The average costs to attend games have soared over the last 10 – 20 years way above the rate of inflation.
3 The cost to run football clubs have also soared over the last 10 – 20 years
4 Clubs should be allowed to ground share FFS AC/Inter Milan do it so why should Scotland be different
5 Clubs have got to look @ the whole picture Celtic/Rangers could start by dropping this 5% pish.
6.16 team league play each outher twice then top six split !!!!!!!!!!
7 league cup should be scrapped its a total loss maker FFS Celtic were only charging 5pounds for heats game & the crowd was crap.
Very good article.
The old saying turkey’s wont vote for Christmas springs to mind.
None of the chairman outside of the Old Firm would vote for these changes, it’s commercial suicide. The old firm have bankrolled these teams for years with their away crowds and they simply cannot afford to write that income off unless the SPL subsidise them for the first few years.
For all that the Keane gamble has proved ineffective for Celtic, we better appreciate his type of player while we can as I reckon that’s the last time we will see an EPL player strut his stuff in the SPL. Celtics wage bill at present is colossal and I can only see that going one way, down. Especially if they miss the Champions League money for the second season in a row. Rangers will have no financial gain from the CL as it will go directly to reducing the debt, making Murrays price for the club, a bit more palatable for those interested.
For me Rangers and Celtic will have reduced squads, probably in the same mould as Rangers at present, a few good players and the rest made up from Scottish talent and whats coming through the youth ranks. Money will be made from selling on good players like Bougherra at a profit and then scouting the lower leagues to try and find another gem.
The gap will stay between the top two and the rest, although it will get smaller, however only Hibs really have the set up to give the old firm a run for their money. The rest are all strangled by debt, including Hearts, Dundee Utd and perennial under achievers Aberdeen.
This article is mostly delusional nonsense by a supporter of the old firm. To state that the old firm have bankrolled other clubs in the SPL is utter crap. It really is time you guys took a step back and saw yourselves as others do. One or other of the old firm have pretty much been mismanaged for the last 20 years and yet still feel that, just because they attract more knuckle dragging supporters than other clubs, somehow this entitles them to more influence in how the domestic game should be run. Some clubs have stood up and refused to cede to the 5% levy by the ugly sisters with no adverse impact. Try broadening your horizons by reading something other The Sun or some rancid old firm fanzine to gather your information.
Thanks for that Baptie, total football at its finest!
To be fair, Falkirk have a fair few knuckle draggers in their support, it just shows up in Celtic and Rangers more because of their size.
percentage wise….who knows who would be worse off?
So…would you advocate the rest of the SPL going it alone without Celtic and Rangers? Would you be happy with it settling down to a natural level and all the clubs being in with a better shout, albeit with far less interest in the game?
To belive anything other than the chairmen of other Scottish clubs have ridden on the back of the big two for far too long is a bit delusional.
The issue of the 5% has worked out okay…but it has worked out okay because of the fan base the two big clubs have. They are more than happy to go to Falkirk, St Mirren, Hibs, Hearts directly for tickets…because they just want to see their team.
The fans aren’t better off – these fans get charged a premium every away game – sure, policing costs are higher but frankly, it is simple economics and the laws of supply and demand.
Celtic and Rangers handled that wrongly, they went in too heavy and came across looking foolish, they need to remember they need to have opposition to play against. However, every other club still rubs their hands at the thought of earning a few extra shekels when these teams roll in.
In short, the price of success for these fans is getting it in the neck at every opportunity. How many away matches a season will Falkirk have on a Saturday at 3pm?
Plenty…and this is good time for football (the Kinks said it, so it must be true!) Meet your friends, pre and post match drink, catch-up and still have a lot of the weekend left to savour.
Celtic and Rangers fans – Saturday afternoon away games? They should be so lucky!
A comparative can be drawn with music.
Say you like small up and coming Glasgow bands. They won’t be in the media a lot, you have to dig around the internets for information but seeing them is a laid back and more preferable experience. It’s less crowded, cheaper and you can get a better pint. It feels worthwhile and as though you are part of a community
Say you like Paul McCartney. You may have all his records but its still a struggle to get tickets for Hampden. When you get there, you’ve been massively overcharged, if you get a drink it’s watered down rubbish and you get the impression you don’t like ¾ of the people around you.
And that’s the breakdown of any argument on these matters. Fans of small clubs will see it as delusional pish but its not. It’s not coming from their 100% viewpoint but equally, they never see how fans of the big two get gouged every single weekend. Some would say they deserve it…but hey, theres a lot of anger in Scottish football and its not only coming from the big two.
Sorry you didnt like the article Baptie – we did put in some balancing arguments – ie, Celtic and Rangers would also feel the pinch with less big games but its always easier to take certain points and make them the focal point. Heck, we lazily do it with headlines all the time.
As stated, we have a few more arguments and articles about the restructuring of Scottish football but you never know, we may charge fans of certain clubs a levvy to read them.
Knuckle draggers? Yes, of course every club has them but you cannot seriously suggest that other clubs supporters carry the same baggage (and no I don’t mean the blue plastic kind with the bottle of tonic wine in) as other clubs? City of Manchester anyone, Rememberance Sunday at Falkirk? Even the fact a minutes silence seems beyond a signifcant number of the supporters says it all really.
I wouldn’t advocate going it alone but it wouldn’t bother me if it happened. Clubs would then be able begin to manage finances more reallistcally. But, I would prefer Celtic and Rangers to stay as they are Scottish clubs and it is often highly amusing laughing at their antics and delusion of grandeur.
I genuinely don’t think all the clubs have ridden on the coat tails of the old firm. I don’t really see how they have helped other clubs generate that much more income. Anything garnered by the tv deals (which would be significantly reduced without the old firm) would be offset by the fact that clubs expenditure would naturally decrease as there wouldn’t be the artifical inflation of player salaries which is caused by the amount the old firm pay foreign duds and EPL mercenaries who come up here for a 4 month ego trip.
This belief, only held by old firm fans and the Scottish media, that somehow they exist as kindly benefactors to the rest of the Scottish game is a total myth and is the biggest delusion in our game. The reality is that both of them would sell their grannies for self enhancement. Of course, they’d rather auction off their grannies together because they can’t really prosper and exist in any real sense without one another. I know this upsets Celtic fans more than Rangers fans as they still have the misguided belief that they are somehow the club of the downtrodden and oppressed. The truth is the club is owned by one of the pioneers of the current global banking ethos with a war mongering member of the establishment as its chairman and could not be further from it’s routes as a club set up to serve the people of it’s community.
I didn’t say I didn’t like the article.
So you liked it and you’re moaning – crikey, thats enough to confuse Steven Pressley.
Mind you, we don’t have the time to list what confuses big Reg.
As for the Celtic debate – a bit of that is very true…anyone who still believes the PLC board is true to the origins of the club needs a wake-up call. Dont get us wrong, Celtic do a lot of good for charity and the community, not saying they don’t..but clearly it is a very different world now.
Certainly the view of the message boards that we have seen about the anger of the joint deal is more about the association with their Govan friends….but hey, money talks for the people in charge.
Re: the baggage thing – 15 fans banned from New Douglas Park due to trouble in Paisley last weekend – thats half a stand for some home games at the Accies! If we were being unkind, we would maybe say it was a Scottish societal issue….magnified by certain elements of Celtic and Rangers support which makes them look really bad.
The early 90s boom to bust approach was really due to the other teams trying to stay even remotely in touch with Rangers – the thought of a conveyor belt of mulleted rubbish players at Hearts brings to mind a football world gone mad! Hopefully clubs will all find their level of expenditure – ideally, producing the youths will lead to an improvement in the game and teams.
Well, let me explain- I can like an article without agreeing to the content. Just like I can appreciate the musicianship on a Dire Straits record without liking the actual music. Even Prezzer’s and his brogues would understand that!
Actually no, I can’t appreciate anything about Dire Straits.
We’re sorry to do this but we’ve had to ban The Baptie Armpit from the site for a period of time.
We don’t mind a lot of racy chat (even some chat about the band Racey – oooh, some girls won’t…some girls won’t…is what we tend to find) – but we will not tolerate chat about Dire Straits!
Haha, nah, he’s still with us – we can’t be seen to be bullying the bairns!
And yes, we know what you mean….it’s like liking The White Album but wishing it was a single as opposed to double album!
i love the way people condemn the iraq war but dont tell us what should not have been done,BTW this crap that the present board @ Celtic is nothing like Boards in the past ,bollocks guys do some history especially on Willie Maley FFS if you don generate Cash clubs fucked as Celtic Found out during there early years of existance.
baptie you want : money for nothing, you would think the old firm, were brothers in arms ,
its simple, players get paid too much, the only people who deserve thousands of pounds per week are people who save lives, doctors, firemen, soldiers, policemen, true heroes, not pansy footballers who give nothing back to the people.
players wages will be the downfall of many big clubs, its happened at Dortmund, it happened at Rangers, its happened at Pompey, its going to happen at Celtic next year, Man Citys time will come too, when the sheik gets bored it will be tits up. Its all down to wages. Chelsea too, when Abramovic leaves, they will be in huge trouble.
General running costs will always be in the game and will not fluctuate like wages so they are not the problem, the increasing wages are. Its making football almost boring and the players who dont deserve to play football are ending up millionnaires just coz they are big, fit and strong, it rarely has anything to do with any real talent they have.
if the whole world kept within their means we would not be in a recession and poverty would be much harder to find, sadly we have so many selfish people who take their millions and run.
A world that revolves round money is a sad world. This is our world.
Great post by the baptie boy – couldn’t agree more
You can’t seriously suggest that non-old firm fans bad behaviour comes even close to the behaviour of a large chunk of the either of the ugly sister’s set.
If you think that then you’re certainly not attending enough non-old firm spl games.
In the years I’ve been going to Rugby Park (27), it’s only a handful of times I’ve seen any bother when the old firm haven’t been in town. Even then it was usually me just getting an evil look or two due to my Dire Straits t-shirt.
You’ll be the first for hanging MWAKF!!
All the CD sales in the 80s wont save you now…
Also, MWAKF, you’ve maybe never been to Tynecastle!!!
Still, changed days from the 80s when a few teams casuals would be able to set about the big two – not that we are condoning that at all.
Mr Farry is my new hero.
On the evil looks and abuse point that McGivern makes. I once remember being abused by a couple of fellow Falkirk fans for wearing a cap and a loop earring! They were calling me “gypo” and such like. That made me real proud to follow my team that day. I mean I’d left my horse and cart miles away from the ground so how did they even know?!
Seriously, the point he makes is valid. Tynecastle is probably a considerably more unpleasant place for a Celtic fan to go than any other fan but if you went to more SPL games that didn’t involve either Celtic or Rangers you’d be hard pushed tio find much bother on a regular basis. Unless you had a Straits t-shirt on that is!
A good few years back, some of the WeKnowSFA team went to the St Mirren v Morton match at Love Street.
Finished 3-2, sendings off, a hat-trick and Paisley panda running about with a giant aerosol spraying it at the away end!
Haha…that was a very good day out, albeit fuelled by £1 bottles of Miller from the Last Post from mid-day.
One of the buddies we know promised it’d be a rare day out with the possibility of it all turning tasty in the shed (yeah, he was a bit Danny Dyer) but from our vantage point behind the goal, it all looked a bit tame.
Domestically, where is all this trouble that you speak of concerning the Old Firm? I go to the games involving my club (Rangers) regularly and there isn’t a fraction of trouble in comparison to the 90′s when regularly we ran the gauntlet at the Easter Rd bridge, had windows smashed in our buses at Tynecastle and The Sheep Pen, look at the Motherwell Rangers game a few weeks back, there were around 10 boys, one in particular that were giving Papac venomous abuse on the touchline.
St Mirren V Rangers at the Methadrome, never heard so much bile directed at the Rangers support outwith and old firm match. You lot have your headers too.
Football is sanatised beyond belief now, some say for the better.